Elders and Governing Body

Blinding Ignorance About Conception Used to Accuse Someone of Lying

Not long ago, some super-secret “training videos” meant for the elders of Jehovah’s Witnesses were leaked online, and I’ve already commented on how one such video shows gross negligence in their instructions on counseling suicidal congregation members. I’ve also already commented on this next subject in particular, but I find it so vulgar and obscene that it deserves its own blog post.

Confession of Fornication

This video in particular deals with a young man, “Robbie,” who has confessed to committing fornication with a girl and getting her pregnant. Robbie presents the matter as a one-night stand, but the elders counseling Robbie ask him when the girl told him that she was pregnant. Robbie says it was “a couple of weeks later.”

At that point, one elder says that this “doesn’t quite add up,” because “a woman would not know she is pregnant in that short of a time. [The girl] would have had to have told you possibly a month and a half after the incident, at least.” He presses the issue later in the video, saying that it would be more likely two months after having had sex before she could know she was pregnant.

Note the whole exchange here, starting at about the 1:15 mark:

Blinding Ignorance

As I’ve brought out in other posts, this statement is so ignorant, it’s blinding. This is not the 1800s where women need to rely on a calendar to tell them when they’re pregnant. A good home pregnancy test today can tell you if you’re pregnant some 5 days before your next period, and a doctor’s blood test can tell you within days of conceiving.

Sometimes, at the doctor’s office, this test is given whether or not a woman suspects she’s pregnant, as a pregnant woman cannot take certain medications or undergo certain procedures. What if this woman had gone to her doctor to have x-rays taken, or as part of a followup for other issues, and the doctor first needed to give her a pregnancy test, and that test revealed her condition? This could have happened within a week or two of her conceiving.

preg testThis “six weeks” scenario is also applicable only if the girl had sex the very day after her last period ended, then waited four more weeks for her next period, then waited two weeks after it was late to determine if she was pregnant. As I’ve said in other posts, what if she had sex on Friday the 1st, but was expecting her next period a week later, on Friday the 8th? She might wait another full week to take a pregnancy test, on Friday the 15th, but the test would confirm her condition, and it would then be “a couple of weeks” after their sexual encounter.

The elder in question seems to be in his 40s and is wearing a wedding ring, so there is absolutely no excuse for this lack of knowledge of conception on his part. It’s also noteworthy that none of the other elders in the room, or Robbie himself, offer him correction. In other words, all the men in the room are ignorant about conception and pregnancy tests.


A grownup, adult, married man, at least in his 40s, has no knowledge of conception or home pregnancy tests, but uses his incorrect assumptions on a woman’s ability to know when she’s pregnant to call someone else a liar.

The Danger of This Ignorance

Pointing out this ignorance for a laugh or an eye roll is one thing, but in truth, this is actually downright dangerous for many in the congregations of Jehovah’s Witnesses. In the video, Robbie does confess that it was more than a one-night stand with this woman, but what about those who may have had sex only one time, and who are accused of lying about it because of this same ignorance?

The elders are given absolute authority when it comes to deciding if such a person should be shunned from the congregation for doing something wrong, and this shunning is complete and all-encompassing. Family members who are still Jehovah’s Witnesses will not speak to their parents, children, or anyone else who is shunned.

The scenario of an elder deciding that a person should be disfellowshipped and shunned because he (the elder) assumes the person is lying is not far-fetched. As I’ve brought out in previous posts, elders are told that “discernment is needed” when a woman claims to have been raped, based on her “mental disposition, circumstances leading up to the incident, and any delays in reporting.”

So, an elder can decide all on his own that a woman is lying about being raped, and may have her shunned for fornication, based simply on his own opinion of her “mental disposition,” his opinion of the circumstances surrounding the rape, and his opinion of when and how she should have reported the incident. Without any formal training in dealing with rape victims, psychology, criminology, PTSD, and the like, he can just decide that she’s a liar, and have her shunned.

Here, too, we see that possibility. While this skit showed that Robbie was caught in a lie, there may be other circumstances where elders don’t realize their own blinding ignorance and stupidity when it comes to conception and pregnancy, and may disfellowship and shun someone despite that person’s truthful pleas of innocence.

Guided by Holy Spirit?

Something else to consider. Before their meeting with Robbie, the elders pray among themselves, and then pray again when Robbie is present. They mention to Robbie the need to be honest, because they have prayed for holy spirit to guide and direct him, and they make sure Robbie understands that a lack of honesty might be “grieving the holy spirit.”

holy spiritHow can I believe that these men have guidance from god’s “holy spirit” when it comes to a person’s heart, if that same holy spirit cannot guide them on something as simple as conception and pregnancy? The holy spirit didn’t somehow magically allow them to understand when a woman can find out she’s pregnant, but it’s supposed to help the elders understand a person’s heart condition, and whether or not that person is repentant of their actions?

This entire scenario calls into question the qualifications of the elders as men who claim to be guided by god. They’re ignorant of something as simple as a pregnancy test and conception, yet think they’re in a position to judge heart conditions.

How can I trust any of them after seeing this video, and why should anyone trust them when they’re obviously so uneducated and without guidance of any sort, much less guidance from the god who supposedly created women and her ability to get pregnant? I’m afraid to tell them that the earth is round and revolves around the sun; I’m not ready to be burned at the stake.

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3 replies »

  1. reminds me of many years ago when I was turfed out for adultery (to which I admitted), when asked why my faith had slipped to such an extent that I would do such a thing I pointed out the flip flops and changes in doctrine and used one of the changes to highlight this. They decided after a few days to throw me out due to the change I mentioned not the adultery, they said I had a problem with the doctrinal change… Even tho I only used the change as an example they seized on that as a pretext to expel me. So really I was being shown the door for apostasy, not adultery… You are right, uneducated dopes the elders who showed me the door, and think about two statements two of these elders made previously… #1. “This is probably the last talk I will give in this system…” (Elder Bob circa late 1974) #2. “Early Christians like Moses and Noah will be resurrected in the new system of things…” (Elder Peter 1973ish.) Think about that one… And these guys were out there teaching the Bible…

  2. These videos had quite a profound effect on me, too, Alex.

    Although I have been out for a couple of years now they were a stark reminder of what I used to be involved in. I found them to be an exact representation of how we used to handle things, and it left me cold.

    Keep up the good work with your writing. It is appreciated.

    • Thank you very much for your kind words, and hopefully you’re on at least one of our supportive Facebook pages so you get the encouragement you need and can encourage others. Take care.

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